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Tab Generator, Finger Chart, & Practice Software; Or what I do in my spare time...
Topic Started: 26 Dec 2012, 07:41 AM (5,788 Views)
OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
Inspired by our very own Robert Hickman's PHP dabblings, as someone who is technically and programmatically inclined myself, I'm currently coding a fingering chart, tabs generator and practice system that I'll be putting up somewhere on the web some time in the future.

However, to kick it up a notch, I've decided to support "non-standard" and multi-chambered (with harmony) ocarinas as well.

The currently implemented fingering systems for tabs are:


  • 4 Hole Pendant
  • 5 Hole Pendant
  • 6 Hole Pendant
  • STL Max Range Pendant
  • STL Max Range Double Pendant
  • 10 Hole Transverse
  • 12 Hole Japanese Transverse
  • 12 Hole Taiwanese Transverse


What are currently in the queue include (in no particular order):


  • 6 Hole Pendant w/sub hole
  • STL Compact Double
  • Double & Triple Taiwanese Transverse
  • Double & Triple Japanese Transverse
  • 11 Hole Pacchioni, Double, Triple, & Quadruple Transverse
  • STL Max Range Double & Triple Bass
  • Songbird Dragon Tooth, Muse, & OoT (cosmetic mods to the standard 10 Hole and 12 Hole Japanese tabs :-) )
  • 7-hole OoT
  • Hind's entire non-standard inventory
  • Mountain Ocarina's entire inventory


In the next few weeks I should have an ABC-notation-to-tabs generator ready to fiddle with (or "oc" with...?) that'll support harmony tabbing "out of the box" (er.. webpage...?).

With the harmony support it's also a bit fun, as the current tab generator can be told to favor one chamber over another in certain contexts, and in the future will also be able to calculate optimal (i.e. the easiest) alternate fingerings when necessary.

I also hope to have some sort of practice system put together with Popcorn.js or some similar library to teach tabs as well as sheet music.

It's an ambitious undertaking, and I'm only working on it a little at a time so... stay tuned. :D
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Wollemi Pine
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Triple-Double Ocarinist

Sounds great! I wish you the best of luck in this effort. Do you need beta testers?

Also, don't forget that Pachioni has his own P fingering, and addition to the V fingering, which I think is the Italian fingering.
Edited by Wollemi Pine, 26 Dec 2012, 09:29 AM.
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Gnomeish
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Double Ocarinist
Sounds amazing! I'll look forward to playing around with this if/when a public version is released. Especially liking multi-chamber ocarinas being included.
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Wollemi Pine
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Triple-Double Ocarinist

Once it's ready, I'll include it into my ABC Primer guide.
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Prairie Wolf
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I'm convinced dogs unfurl their wings when we are not looking!
Wow, what a nice tool that will be. Sounds wonderful!
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
I will certainly need testers... especially with all of the bugs I can see from writing the ABC interpreter alone... There are no good PHP solutions ready-made for that so I'm stuck doing it from scratch.
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SuperBobKing
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Quadruple Ocarinist
Really? I thought there were ABC interpreters written in pretty much everything.
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
Nope. You can get an ABC *wrapper* in almost anything, but nothing *native* in PHP. On shared hosting that's a big drawback.
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Wollemi Pine
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Triple-Double Ocarinist

I noticed the one formerly at Folkinfo also appears to user an ABC wrapper.
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
Ok here's the ABC to tabs typesetter. It's unpolished and ugly as sin... but it works surprisingly well. :-)

http://ocarina.rogueleaf.com/tab/

It scrubs out a lot of ABC features that I'm going to add in slowly and harmony (with brackets []) is not implemented yet as I'm working on that now, but it can do basic single melody tabs for all of the ocarinas listed in whatever key you tell it to.
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Wollemi Pine
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Triple-Double Ocarinist

That looks great! An excellent start!
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
Danke. :-)

More shall come.
Speaking of which, harmony now works:

http://ocarina.rogueleaf.com/tab/?oc=STLMaxRangeDoublePendant&tune=%5BCc%5D%5BDd%5D%5BEe%5D%5BFf%5D%5BGg%5D

:pirate:
Edited by OcSteve, 28 Dec 2012, 04:20 AM.
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Endalion
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Triple Ocarinist x 3
10-hole automatically assumes Asian fingering and the Italian fingering option is missing. Key of C is also assumed automatically, although this is not the case for all ocarinas. You should make a multi-octave key selector for choosing the base note.
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
One step ahead of you on that: The functionality to modulate the base note to change the key of the ocarina is actually already implemented in the tab formatter, but the demo's GUI doesn't give the user access to it yet; also, the Italian fingering base tab hasn't been uploaded, although it's pretty much ready to go. :)
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
@Endalion - Actually it looks like I misunderstood you. I thought you were referring to Pacchioni with the split right little finger.

The 10-hole fingering currently up is on an asian body, but from what I see looking back over it is that it seems to be Donati 10-hole fingering. What 10-hole style did I miss? (I primarily play English fingering, so I need some direction here. :) )
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Endalion
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Triple Ocarinist x 3
Asian Fingering: Right pinky is lifted last
Italian/European Fingering: Right thumb is lifted last.

Otherwise the same as asian, but these two switch places.

See 10-hole transverse(European) from Robert Hickman's fingering chart generator as reference http://occhart.robehickman.com/chartgen/index
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
You mean left pinky? All examples of European ocarinas I can find (Italian, Austrian, Bavarian), even vintage ones, seem to lift the left pinky last to keep balance.
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Jonnvoll
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Transverse Ocarinist
This looks really promising. Kudos for the "Out of Range" overlays, I don't think I've seen that before. Great Job. I'm looking forward to see the evolution of this. Looks like you've got a pretty detailed plan.
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elukeroo
Beginner
OcSteve
26 Dec 2012, 07:41 AM
Inspired by our very own Robert Hickman's PHP dabblings, as someone who is technically and programmatically inclined myself, I'm currently coding a fingering chart, tabs generator and practice system that I'll be putting up somewhere on the web some time in the future.

However, to kick it up a notch, I've decided to support "non-standard" and multi-chambered (with harmony) ocarinas as well.

The currently implemented fingering systems for tabs are:


  • 4 Hole Pendant
  • 5 Hole Pendant
  • 6 Hole Pendant
  • STL Max Range Pendant
  • STL Max Range Double Pendant
  • 10 Hole Transverse
  • 12 Hole Japanese Transverse
  • 12 Hole Taiwanese Transverse


What are currently in the queue include (in no particular order):


  • 6 Hole Pendant w/sub hole
  • STL Compact Double
  • Double & Triple Taiwanese Transverse
  • Double & Triple Japanese Transverse
  • 11 Hole Pacchioni, Double, Triple, & Quadruple Transverse
  • STL Max Range Double & Triple Bass
  • Songbird Dragon Tooth, Muse, & OoT (cosmetic mods to the standard 10 Hole and 12 Hole Japanese tabs :-) )
  • 7-hole OoT
  • Hind's entire non-standard inventory
  • Mountain Ocarina's entire inventory


In the next few weeks I should have an ABC-notation-to-tabs generator ready to fiddle with (or "oc" with...?) that'll support harmony tabbing "out of the box" (er.. webpage...?).

With the harmony support it's also a bit fun, as the current tab generator can be told to favor one chamber over another in certain contexts, and in the future will also be able to calculate optimal (i.e. the easiest) alternate fingerings when necessary.

I also hope to have some sort of practice system put together with Popcorn.js or some similar library to teach tabs as well as sheet music.

It's an ambitious undertaking, and I'm only working on it a little at a time so... stay tuned. :D
What a wonderful idea! The students in my club would really benefit from access to programs like that. Thank you.
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SuperBobKing
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Quadruple Ocarinist
OcSteve
28 Dec 2012, 11:45 PM
You mean left pinky? All examples of European ocarinas I can find (Italian, Austrian, Bavarian), even vintage ones, seem to lift the left pinky last to keep balance.
Nope. On Italian ocarinas the highest notes are lift left thumb, left pinkie, then right thumb.
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
SuperBobKing
29 Dec 2012, 02:32 AM
Nope. On Italian ocarinas the highest notes are lift left thumb, left pinkie, then right thumb.
Curious. :)

Well, the difference is now implemented.
Jonnvoll
29 Dec 2012, 12:31 AM
This looks really promising. Kudos for the "Out of Range" overlays, I don't think I've seen that before. Great Job. I'm looking forward to see the evolution of this. Looks like you've got a pretty detailed plan.
Thanks. :-)

Over the next few releases it'll prompt you to see if you want to transpose the song and additional out of range notes to fit the currently selected ocarina's range rather than evoke the Out of Range signs (in similar fashion to the Songbird tab system).
elukeroo
29 Dec 2012, 12:42 AM
What a wonderful idea! The students in my club would really benefit from access to programs like that. Thank you.
My pleasure. :) When it starts to take shape and your club uses it, if you have any ideas for new features I'll see what I can do.
Edited by OcSteve, 29 Dec 2012, 02:59 AM.
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SuperBobKing
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Quadruple Ocarinist
d e f on an Italian should be first lift left thumb then lift left pinkie then lift right thumb. It is currently lift right thumb lift left pinkie lift left thumb.
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
I actually had the holes mis-numbered in the meta file. Should be fixed now.

http://ocarina.rogueleaf.com/test_range.php?oc=Transverse10HoleEuropean
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SuperBobKing
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Quadruple Ocarinist
It is working now. Also, you should add some form of support for harmony on single chambers, such as only showing the first note or showing two lines in different colors or something. Currently it just shows the out of range message.
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Wollemi Pine
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Triple-Double Ocarinist

OcSteve
29 Dec 2012, 03:25 AM
I actually had the holes mis-numbered in the meta file. Should be fixed now.

http://ocarina.rogueleaf.com/test_range.php?oc=Transverse10HoleEuropean
I like that test range. Can you also put the music note under each one as well?
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
SuperBobKing
29 Dec 2012, 03:44 AM
It is working now. Also, you should add some form of support for harmony on single chambers, such as only showing the first note or showing two lines in different colors or something. Currently it just shows the out of range message.
It should place the first requested note in the harmony bracket (provided that the chamber can handle it) and then "Out of Range" on top of it if any additional notes requested. I'll see about a better means to express missing harmony. Perhaps even a way to choose which note within harmony pairs or triplets is displayed and break them up into separate parts for the same oc? :-)
Wollemi Pine
29 Dec 2012, 03:45 AM
I like that test range. Can you also put the music note under each one as well?
That's on the to-do list. :)

Once it's a little further on, it'll also have both letter and staff notation of some variety. Right now it's just a quick and dirty page to test if progression is correct in the metafile.
Edited by OcSteve, 29 Dec 2012, 04:15 AM.
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
Still working on formatting note names in a good location, but if you mouse over any of the tab images, it tells you the note (or combination of notes) it represents.
And now note names are right on each tab. I'm not satisfied with it, but it's a start.
Edited by OcSteve, 30 Dec 2012, 07:58 AM.
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Wollemi Pine
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Triple-Double Ocarinist

You're making excellent progress!
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Flx-Cvz
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No, I'm not a clown.
Looking pretty great! It works really nice and I think that this will help a lot, please, keep going C:
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
Sharps and flats are now arranged like piano keys in the range test page:

http://ocarina.rogueleaf.com/test_range.php?oc=Transverse10HoleEuropean

I'm going to clean it up even further over the next few nights and finally add in base note modulation to the GUI.
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
Forgot to mention: The STL Max Range Triple Bass is up and available on the ABC to tabs generator as well:

http://ocarina.rogueleaf.com/test_range.php?oc=STLMaxRangeTripleBass
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pandorado100
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Premium Poster
Hey thanks for putting up a fingering chart for the STL Max Range Double Pendant. They sent me the wrong chart when they shipped my order. I have the one for the regular Max Range pendant not the double. Every time I want to play the MRDP, I have to log onto the STL site and browse for the right chart to refresh my memory because I don't really like to play it that much so I forget the fingerings for the second chamber.

Now I can just link to your chart. It's so convenient. :)
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
No problem. I'm glad that others make use of it! :D As you can probably see from my avatar, I have an inexplicable fondness for my MRDP.

You can also use the tabs generator with it, too, which can tab out harmonies (just use []s like in standard ABC notation for chords); however, in the future, I'm going to have the program calculate out using the thumb holes to optimize harmonies so that it keeps your index and middle fingers as closely paired as possible between both chambers.

The current tabs setup also currently favors the higher chamber (i.e. it'll prefer the upper chamber's low C rather than the lower chamber's high C) as the MRDP I have gets a little breathy on high C D and E on the low chamber.

I wonder if sending the wrong chart happens often with STL. I ordered a bunch of their blue plastic 7-hole soprano C pendants, and only one of them came with a chart: A Rupee Pendant chart... that had a typo on one of the fingerings! :)
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TheZ
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Multichamber Ocarinist
That isn't a typo, it's the correct fingering.
OX
OO <-Doesn't work:pitch is too high
--
OO
OX <-Is correct... but weird
Is your 'Plentiful Player of Pendants' a spoof on my old 'Hater of Pendants'?
Edited by TheZ, 3 Jan 2013, 03:51 AM.
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pandorado100
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Premium Poster
OcSteve
3 Jan 2013, 03:34 AM
No problem. I'm glad that others make use of it! :D As you can probably see from my avatar, I have an inexplicable fondness for my MRDP.

You can also use the tabs generator with it, too, which can tab out harmonies (just use []s like in standard ABC notation for chords); however, in the future, I'm going to have the program calculate out using the thumb holes to optimize harmonies so that it keeps your index and middle fingers as closely paired as possible between both chambers.

The current tabs setup also currently favors the higher chamber (i.e. it'll prefer the upper chamber's low C rather than the lower chamber's high C) as the MRDP I have gets a little breathy on high C D and E on the low chamber.

I wonder if sending the wrong chart happens often with STL. I ordered a bunch of their blue plastic 7-hole soprano C pendants, and only one of them came with a chart: A Rupee Pendant chart... that had a typo on one of the fingerings! :)
The extreme airiness of the high D and E on the first chamber of the MRDP is one of the reasons I don't like it as much as my regular Compact Double pendant. I can compensate for that by playing the low D and E fingering on the second chamber but it annoys me to not have the flexibility to play those notes on both chambers.
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
TheZ
3 Jan 2013, 03:50 AM
That isn't a typo, it's the correct fingering.
OX
OO <-Doesn't work:pitch is too high
--
OO
OX <-Is correct... but weird
Is your 'Plentiful Player of Pendants' a spoof on my old 'Hater of Pendants'?
That's quite odd. I wonder how one plays A#/Bb with that system.

In either case, it was incorrect for the plastic ocarinas I ordered (all of which used standard English fingering).

Hehe and nah I wasn't making fun of your epithet. In truth, I didn't even see it until after I had chosen mine.
Edited by OcSteve, 3 Jan 2013, 04:22 PM.
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Endalion
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Triple Ocarinist x 3
Could you make the converter preserve note length information when converting ABC to tabs? Example graphics for pendant tabs with note length info included is attached.

Attached to this post:
Attachments: PendantTabs.png (92.44 KB)
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TheZ
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Multichamber Ocarinist
I think that'd be extremely useful!
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Wollemi Pine
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Triple-Double Ocarinist

Endalion
3 Jan 2013, 06:45 PM
Could you make the converter preserve note length information when converting ABC to tabs? Example graphics for pendant tabs with note length info included is attached.

That would be so close to being sheet music....
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
Endalion
3 Jan 2013, 06:45 PM
Could you make the converter preserve note length information when converting ABC to tabs? Example graphics for pendant tabs with note length info included is attached.

I was just tinkering with something like that earlier today but I haven't made it live yet. Once it's up (and not horridly buggy) I'll update here. :-)

I'm also actively working on supporting lyrics.
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
I am so close to getting the note length information working as well as lyrics. More updates and a workable demo soon. :-)
Almost there. Here's a peek:

http://ocarina.rogueleaf.com/tab/?test
Edited by OcSteve, 6 Jan 2013, 07:19 AM.
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
Ok, the little note signature and lyrics has been implemented into the main build. I'll be fine-tuning it over the next few days. Right now the notes clash with the 10 and 12 hole ocarina tabs, but that's soon to be fixed. :-)
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
Still trying to get a better way to keep beat, but now it actually pads things out.

http://ocarina.rogueleaf.com/tab/
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OcSteve
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A Plentiful Player of Pendants
Ok, another quick update with three more things on the To-Do List:

1) A save feature which will allow you to freeze and save a particular version of tabs. You can then, with a single click, re-enter them into the editor and save a new version however you like. It also keeps track of a set of tabs' revisions and branches. So if you find some tabs you like on the system, but want to make some changes, you can do so easily import the old set into the editor and build upon previous work. You can also browse the tabs' "tree" to see what other versions exist out there.

2) Basic user accounts so you can keep track of the tabs you've saved if you want to. This will also allow users a place to organize their favorite tabs.

3) An export tabs to image option which will cache a jpeg of the finished tabs on the server for easy sharing. (So you can use image tags to share on a forum, etc.)

Any other ideas?
Edited by OcSteve, 12 Jan 2013, 10:54 PM.
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TheZ
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Multichamber Ocarinist
OcSteve
12 Jan 2013, 10:54 PM
3) An export tabs to image option which will cache a jpeg of the finished tabs on the server for easy sharing. (So you can use image tags to share on a forum, etc.)
That'd be great! I never tab, but when I do(I pity people who's requests don't get fulfilled) I hate having to take a screenshot and host it.
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